The Poker Thread

Okay, I'm downloading Camstasia now.

Going through a bad patch at the moment, feels like I can't get any action and then when I do it's the worst flop possible for my cards

<Edit> Managed to get all in pre-flop with Kings only to find out the other guy had exactly the same.

<Edit 2> All in pre-flop with AKs, hit an A on the flop, two 8s on the turn and river. Other guy has AA. $6 down and stopping for a bit.

It took ages to import the last 3 months worth of tournaments into pokertracker, but it's finally finished now.

Looking at the stats my best ROI is from the $3 and $4 tournaments with 140-240 players. If I combine similar tournaments ($4.00 180-mans, $3.20 MTT with 140 players, $3.70 MTT with 240 players) then I have a ROI of 992% for those but I've not played very many of them so it doesn't really mean anything.

The tournaments I've played the most on Stars are the 1,2, and 3 table $5 SnGs and I have a ROI of 10%, 43%, and 99% respectively for those.

The only tournament that I've played quite a few of and lost money is the $5 MTTs with over 2500 players (ROI -10%).

The combined ROI for all my tournaments is 25%.

I guess it makes sense to stick with tournaments, I'm going to play some now

My first tournament didn't go to well. It was a $5 27-man SnG:

Poker Stars $5.00+$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t15/t30 Blinds - 8 players - View hand 149663
Hand History Converter

BTN: t3040 M = 67.56
Hero (SB): t910 M = 20.22
BB: t1935 M = 43
UTG: t2730 M = 60.67
UTG+1: t1710 M = 38
MP1: t1285 M = 28.56
MP2: t1375 M = 30.56
CO: t515 M = 11.44

Pre Flop: (t45) Hero is SB with 6 A
3 folds, MP2 calls t30, 1 fold, BTN calls t30, Hero calls t15, BB checks

Flop: (t120) 6 A 4 (4 players)
Hero checks, BB bets t120, MP2 calls t120, BTN folds, Hero raises to t360, BB raises to t1905 all in, MP2 folds, Hero calls t520 all in

Turn: (t2000) 7 (2 players - 2 are all in)

River: (t2000) 4 (2 players - 2 are all in)

Final Pot: t2000
Hero shows 6 A (two pair, Aces and Sixes)
BB shows 6 4 (a full house, Fours full of Sixes)
BB wins t2000

satriales wrote:Those ROIs

Sick.

PsychicSykes says (17:57):
Sup anyway?
Ben says (17:58):
Not much
Ben says (17:58):
Got in a while ago
PsychicSykes says (17:58):
kewl
Ben says (17:58):
you?
PsychicSykes says (17:59):
bleh
PsychicSykes says (17:59):
Wondering what rope to use now Gaz has beat me to winning a 4.40

I'll try and win another one before Sykes does

I hate you both.

I disagree with cash being a long grind for little profit tbh. You have a TINY sample of tournament hands and clearly have run pretty good. I don't doubt you play good too but there is no reason to think cash is not really as profitable. If you want to actually improve your for the long term I'd suggest cash games.

Roll took more hits over last few days and was down to as low as £337. Right now is £504 though, many thanks to this:

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/1438/huwin.jpg

All $20NL HU. Demonstrates the sick variance of HU games! 6 buyin EV difference over just that many hands. Easy game though right?

So you staking me Rex?

In other news, 11th in my 3rd LPPL game of the season, but could have been so much worse! Could have gone out on the vrey first hand!

Call 8-4 diamonds on the button, flop comes 7-6-5! Someone had 9-8....

Still, considering thats not a bad result in the end. The guy who nicked most of my chips actually went out before me!

DML wrote:So you staking me Rex?

In other news, 11th in my 3rd LPPL game of the season, but could have been so much worse! Could have gone out on the vrey first hand!

Call 8-4 diamonds on the button, flop comes 7-6-5! Someone had 9-8....

Still, considering thats not a bad result in the end. The guy who nicked most of my chips actually went out before me!

Fold pre.

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:So you staking me Rex?

In other news, 11th in my 3rd LPPL game of the season, but could have been so much worse! Could have gone out on the vrey first hand!

Call 8-4 diamonds on the button, flop comes 7-6-5! Someone had 9-8....

Still, considering thats not a bad result in the end. The guy who nicked most of my chips actually went out before me!

Fold pre.

You have to mix your game up, I'm on the button and its the first hand. Theres only one hand that has me beat, it just sucks that he had it at that time. I wouldnt do that in cash, but in a tournament, you have to mix up in legitimate positions to play.

DML wrote:

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:So you staking me Rex?

In other news, 11th in my 3rd LPPL game of the season, but could have been so much worse! Could have gone out on the vrey first hand!

Call 8-4 diamonds on the button, flop comes 7-6-5! Someone had 9-8....

Still, considering thats not a bad result in the end. The guy who nicked most of my chips actually went out before me!

Fold pre.

You have to mix your game up, I'm on the button and its the first hand. Theres only one hand that has me beat, it just sucks that he had it at that time. I wouldnt do that in cash, but in a tournament, you have to mix up in legitimate positions to play.

There's mixing it up and just playing trash. If you must play it raise for deception and the ability to take it down on the flop. Also, how did you not get all your chips in with the second nuts?

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:So you staking me Rex?

In other news, 11th in my 3rd LPPL game of the season, but could have been so much worse! Could have gone out on the vrey first hand!

Call 8-4 diamonds on the button, flop comes 7-6-5! Someone had 9-8....

Still, considering thats not a bad result in the end. The guy who nicked most of my chips actually went out before me!

Fold pre.

You have to mix your game up, I'm on the button and its the first hand. Theres only one hand that has me beat, it just sucks that he had it at that time. I wouldnt do that in cash, but in a tournament, you have to mix up in legitimate positions to play.

There's mixing it up and just playing trash. If you must play it raise for deception and the ability to take it down on the flop. Also, how did you not get all your chips in with the second nuts?

Because I couldnt see what he had that would have him betting that hard into it. He bet out 800 on the river, and I was happy that a call was the right move at that time. Just as well I did. I was a bit suspicious I guess.

I like to play position, and with the types of player I had, I would have got a call to most raises. Best play the hand and see what happens.

DML wrote:

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:So you staking me Rex?

In other news, 11th in my 3rd LPPL game of the season, but could have been so much worse! Could have gone out on the vrey first hand!

Call 8-4 diamonds on the button, flop comes 7-6-5! Someone had 9-8....

Still, considering thats not a bad result in the end. The guy who nicked most of my chips actually went out before me!

Fold pre.

You have to mix your game up, I'm on the button and its the first hand. Theres only one hand that has me beat, it just sucks that he had it at that time. I wouldnt do that in cash, but in a tournament, you have to mix up in legitimate positions to play.

There's mixing it up and just playing trash. If you must play it raise for deception and the ability to take it down on the flop. Also, how did you not get all your chips in with the second nuts?

Because I couldnt see what he had that would have him betting that hard into it. He bet out 800 on the river, and I was happy that a call was the right move at that time. Just as well I did. I was a bit suspicious I guess.

I like to play position, and with the types of player I had, I would have got a call to most raises. Best play the hand and see what happens.

Results orientated thinking for the win. If you still had the second nuts at the river then not raising either means you should be playing at the Bellagio with your sick reads (TM Kenny Tran) or you didn't assign too much thought into what his range of hands was.

I appreciate the power of position and abuse the button frequently, but you can't say that limping 84 is playing position. You're not using it to much advantage as you're letting one, maybe two opponents in cheap and you'll have no idea what they have. If you raise there, you have a chance that the guy with 98 folds and you take it down easy. Yes, you will get called sometimes but this is when you use position to steal and get value the times you do flop big. Instead you allowed him to play his hand perfectly and take some chips from you.

Well, that one time - you'd have to put me in the sick read category. I had a feeling he had it, but had to call to see. He did. He could have had a few other things, but there ya go. You don't always raise all-in with the King High flush just because you have the second nuts, so you can always think twice when you have the second nut straight.

Perhaps I could have raised that time, but I assure you this player would still have called. It would have achieved nothing in this particular game. However, I agree that how I played it was scew-iff.....but I'm sitting down to have some fun in a free poker game. I've got the button, a suited hand and 50 to play - lets play. It screwed me badly this one time, but this kind of thing happens from time to time.

I must be doing something right if I've been selected as the best player to represent my region. Thats not bad is it?

Rex McGee wrote:I disagree with cash being a long grind for little profit tbh. You have a TINY sample of tournament hands and clearly have run pretty good. I don't doubt you play good too but there is no reason to think cash is not really as profitable. If you want to actually improve your for the long term I'd suggest cash games.

I've no doubt that long term cash is the much more profitable option, but for me right now at my stakes tournaments seem to give a better return than cash tables. I've tried both and I've done ok at cash and really well at the SnG's, so I'm just going to stick with those for a little while.

According to Pokertracker my BB/100 for 6-max 10NL is 10.50 which doesn't sound too bad, but when you actually look at it I've played 44hrs and won $76. Just yesterday I played a $4 tournament for not much more than 2hrs and won $216. Obviously I'm not going to win tournaments that often but still the profit per hour in tournaments seems to be much higher than at the cash tables. I'm sure if I were to move up the stakes at the cash tables then the story would be different but for now I think tournaments are what I need to be playing.

Yeah for sure keep doing but the general feeling from the poker community is a good solid cash player can beat most tournaments but it doens't work the other way. I still just think it's variance. I don't like playing a tournament for 3 hours, not getting too far then going out AQ vs AK AI pre. Now they seem like a waste of my time but maybe I'm just rubbish.

Cash on the other hand:

http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/6092/nuwi.jpg

I couldn't resist playing more just now. Best 24 hours of play I have ever had. Again all at $20NL. Roll £565 + a fair bit of rakeback to come.

DML I cannot really afford to stake you properly for $10NL, nor am I convinced it will be profitable for me. If I do stake you as I said I'd like to see you playing with some of your own money a little first perhaps. If I decide to then you will only be able to play when I am at the computer as well. The reason is so I can record all your HH and hence profit to make sure you aren't scamming me etc. I'd transfer money to you at the start of a session and expect it back at the end with you taking the appropriate cut. Does this seem ok? Not sure on exact deal yet. $10NL is perhaps possible for a trial but I am not looking to lose more than 5 buyins so you better hope variance is on your side if we do that!

To be fair, Satriales definitely seems like the best tournament player on here. Others suit ring games, but hes the best at MTTs undoubtedly.

satriales wrote:

Rex McGee wrote:I disagree with cash being a long grind for little profit tbh. You have a TINY sample of tournament hands and clearly have run pretty good. I don't doubt you play good too but there is no reason to think cash is not really as profitable. If you want to actually improve your for the long term I'd suggest cash games.

I've no doubt that long term cash is the much more profitable option, but for me right now at my stakes tournaments seem to give a better return than cash tables. I've tried both and I've done ok at cash and really well at the SnG's, so I'm just going to stick with those for a little while.

According to Pokertracker my BB/100 for 6-max 10NL is 10.50 which doesn't sound too bad, but when you actually look at it I've played 44hrs and won $76. Just yesterday I played a $4 tournament for not much more than 2hrs and won $216. Obviously I'm not going to win tournaments that often but still the profit per hour in tournaments seems to be much higher than at the cash tables. I'm sure if I were to move up the stakes at the cash tables then the story would be different but for now I think tournaments are what I need to be playing.

I've found I've been running badly in cash recently, but tournaments have kept the roll at $1200. As well as winning that $4 (Sat Five!), I've come in the top 100 back to back in 4000+ man tournaments. I'd be doing much better but recent cash form is poor.

Might do some tourney grinding next week, but for now going down to the casino tonight for a £15 tourney. Should only be about 40-50 runners, so wish me luck!

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:

PsychicSykes wrote:

DML wrote:So you staking me Rex?

In other news, 11th in my 3rd LPPL game of the season, but could have been so much worse! Could have gone out on the vrey first hand!

Call 8-4 diamonds on the button, flop comes 7-6-5! Someone had 9-8....

Still, considering thats not a bad result in the end. The guy who nicked most of my chips actually went out before me!

Fold pre.

You have to mix your game up, I'm on the button and its the first hand. Theres only one hand that has me beat, it just sucks that he had it at that time. I wouldnt do that in cash, but in a tournament, you have to mix up in legitimate positions to play.

There's mixing it up and just playing trash. If you must play it raise for deception and the ability to take it down on the flop. Also, how did you not get all your chips in with the second nuts?

Because I couldnt see what he had that would have him betting that hard into it. He bet out 800 on the river, and I was happy that a call was the right move at that time. Just as well I did. I was a bit suspicious I guess.

I like to play position, and with the types of player I had, I would have got a call to most raises. Best play the hand and see what happens.

Results orientated thinking for the win. If you still had the second nuts at the river then not raising either means you should be playing at the Bellagio with your sick reads (TM Kenny Tran) or you didn't assign too much thought into what his range of hands was.

I appreciate the power of position and abuse the button frequently, but you can't say that limping 84 is playing position. You're not using it to much advantage as you're letting one, maybe two opponents in cheap and you'll have no idea what they have. If you raise there, you have a chance that the guy with 98 folds and you take it down easy. Yes, you will get called sometimes but this is when you use position to steal and get value the times you do flop big. Instead you allowed him to play his hand perfectly and take some chips from you.

That I agree with. I wouldn't personally play 8-4, but even if you are going to, fair enough. But raise, always raise there. That way you represent a big hand on the flop and if that guy even comes for the ride (which he is not always going to do), if he doesn't flop the nuts (which he won't in the long term obv.), he'll give you credit for any high card most of the time. Limping there is not the ideal play there, IMO, you have to raise if you're definitely going to play.